Turbo Sliders 2.0.0 Beta

Post by **Badeend** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:11 pm

I'm very sorry to bother you with this, but I still see some behaviour of which I think shouldn't be there. The thing is that your car will never completely stop when you just release throttle. Is it a bug or a feature?

Ande · Post by **Ande** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:27 pm

Badeend wrote:I'm very sorry to bother you with this, but I still see some behaviour of which I think shouldn't be there. The thing is that your car will never completely stop when you just release throttle. Is it a bug or a feature?

Yes I think that can be considered to be a bug, thanks for noticing it. Fortunately, it is not a very critical one and can probably be fixed without having to invalidate records once again.

In case someone is wondering why all these odd bugs have emerged now, it is because of the game engine changes which I hope make network games work slightly better. In 1.0.x, the game always uses 32-bit floating point numbers for position, speed etc. But in network games, 16-bit approximations are sent to save network bandwidth. In the new version, positions and speeds are rounded so that the 16-bit approximations should in fact be exact. This should remove some network game problems in the old version but it causes these weird things. Not stopping is because the speed is decreasing such small amounts that it gets rounded up every time it tries to go down. But I try to fix this in the next version, but without hurry unless something more critical is found. Let me know if you find anything similar.

Jarno · Post by **Jarno** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:11 pm

One thing which is annoying is that when you use alt+tab to go in windows and then you click turbosliders file from taskbar to go back in game your cursor goes in left top corner of screen. This can happen like four times a round. Its kind of annoying when you try to quickly go back to game but you cant because it wont click the game but move cursor somewhere

And alt+tab thing is also when there is black loadin screen in ts (like finding server) and you alt+tab the game wont "minimize" but its on so long that thing is loaded inside ts.

Hard to explain these things

Jazzyclub · Post by **Jazzyclub** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:15 pm

Italian translation update

Post by **Tijny** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:34 pm

Ande, could you make the ingame master server browser only show servers running the currently active mod? The public beta has been going on for 1 day, and it's already quite annoying how many servers there are that I can't (and won't) join anyway. Or, at least make it so that the ones I can join are on top.

Post by **dede** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:23 pm

Tijny wrote:Ande, could you make the ingame master server browser only show servers running the currently active mod? The public beta has been going on for 1 day, and it's already quite annoying how many servers there are that I can't (and won't) join anyway. Or, at least make it so that the ones I can join are on top.

Yup, many players don't like that

Ande · Post by **Ande** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 9:47 pm

Tijny wrote:Ande, could you make the ingame master server browser only show servers running the currently active mod? The public beta has been going on for 1 day, and it's already quite annoying how many servers there are that I can't (and won't) join anyway. Or, at least make it so that the ones I can join are on top.

Do you mean you are playing 1.0.8 or 2.0? In 2.0, it should be so that the servers you can join are on top and the ones you can't are grayed out and on bottom. But of course, there may be a bug if it is not that way.

Post by **Tijny** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:03 pm

2.0. I'm not sure, I thought there was a server I could join between all of the grayed out ones. Can't reproduce it right now though, so maybe I was just impatient and it hadn't finished loading yet.

Post by **Badeend** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:34 pm

I've been experiencing some major fps issues. I tried 1.08 and 2.0 with the same video settings. In 1.08 I had a load of 20% and 50fps, in 2.0 I had a load of 100% and 11fps.
I replaced SDL.dll with the version from 1.08 and it all seems to be working fine now. I wonder why a newer version of SDL.dll can cause such a thing :/

Ande · Post by **Ande** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:45 pm

Badeend wrote:I've been experiencing some major fps issues. I tried 1.08 and 2.0 with the same video settings. In 1.08 I had a load of 20% and 50fps, in 2.0 I had a load of 100% and 11fps.
I replaced SDL.dll with the version from 1.08 and it all seems to be working fine now. I wonder why a newer version of SDL.dll can cause such a thing :/

What resolution do you have? Have you changed any default settings? Is 2.0 as slow if you turn DirectX on? Could you give more specs of your computer?

Ande · Post by **Ande** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:50 pm

Ande wrote:
Badeend wrote: The thing is that your car will never completely stop when you just release throttle. Is it a bug or a feature?
Yes I think that can be considered to be a bug, thanks for noticing it. Fortunately, it is not a very critical one and can probably be fixed without having to invalidate records once again.

Actually, now that I have been testing things more, it seems it may after all be necessary to invalidate records again. But I will investigate this more later, just try not to drive too perfect laps quite yet

.

Post by **Badeend** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:21 pm

Ande wrote:
Badeend wrote:I've been experiencing some major fps issues. I tried 1.08 and 2.0 with the same video settings. In 1.08 I had a load of 20% and 50fps, in 2.0 I had a load of 100% and 11fps.
I replaced SDL.dll with the version from 1.08 and it all seems to be working fine now. I wonder why a newer version of SDL.dll can cause such a thing :/
What resolution do you have? Have you changed any default settings? Is 2.0 as slow if you turn DirectX on? Could you give more specs of your computer?

My pc specs are as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3500+ @ 2.2GHz
Geforce 6600 GT
1 GB ram
Windows XP pro SP3
DirectX version: 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)

Default settings ( both 2.0 and 1.08 ):

Code: Select all

Resolution:             1280x1024
Full screen:            Yes
Double buffering:       No
Shrink to fit:          Yes
Enlarge to fit:         Yes
Zoom factor:            1.0
Predictive cam:         No
Smoke:                  Yes
Shadows:                Yes
Skidmarks:              Medium
Alpha blending:         Yes
Lightmapping:           Yes
Menu effects:           Yes

Some tests on a single player local game on Banaring:

Code: Select all

TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.9.0:     50fps @ 20%
TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.13.0:    11fps @ 100%
TS 2.0 DirectX 9.0c:    50fps @ 20%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.9.0:    50fps @ 20%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.13.0:   10fps @ 100%

Some tests on an AI fill 4 local game on Banaring:

Code: Select all

TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.9.0:     50fps @ 50%
TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.13.0:    10fps @ 100%
TS 2.0 DirectX 9.0c:    50fps @ 60%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.9.0:    50fps @ 50%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.13.0:   10fps @ 100%

Jazzyclub · Post by **Jazzyclub** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:41 am

ive same problem with the directx in 2.0

1280*1024
intel dual core E2140 @ 1800mhz
2gb ram corsair xms2
geforce 8600 GTS 256mb ddr2
windows XP SP2
directx 9.0c

same turbo sliders settings of badeend

Hengari · Post by **Hengari** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 9:59 am

Badeend wrote:I've been experiencing some major fps issues. I tried 1.08 and 2.0 with the same video settings. In 1.08 I had a load of 20% and 50fps, in 2.0 I had a load of 100% and 11fps.
I replaced SDL.dll with the version from 1.08 and it all seems to be working fine now. I wonder why a newer version of SDL.dll can cause such a thing :/

Have you tried running the game on just 1 CPU like explained in viewtopic.php?p=10226#10226 or tried the tips concerning running TS in Vista: viewtopic.php?t=1134

Post by **Tijny** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 10:03 am

Hengari wrote:Have you tried running the game on just 1 CPU like explained in viewtopic.php?p=10226#10226 or tried the tips concerning running TS in Vista: viewtopic.php?t=1134

If you read a little further, you can see that he doesn't have a dual core CPU, or Vista.

Jarno · Post by **Jarno** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 10:26 am

Badeend wrote: Some tests on a single player local game on Banaring:
Code: Select all
TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.9.0:     50fps @ 20%
TS 2.0 SDL 1.2.13.0:    11fps @ 100%
TS 2.0 DirectX 9.0c:    50fps @ 20%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.9.0:    50fps @ 20%
TS 1.08 SDL 1.2.13.0:   10fps @ 100%
[/code]

I had in 2.0 and 1.08 11fps @ 99% with 1.2.9.0 SDL version when all eye candy were on. Same situation with new SDL. Then i used directx and it works well now

Hengari · Post by **Hengari** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 5:06 pm

Tijny wrote:
Hengari wrote:Have you tried running the game on just 1 CPU like explained in viewtopic.php?p=10226#10226 or tried the tips concerning running TS in Vista: viewtopic.php?t=1134
If you read a little further, you can see that he doesn't have a dual core CPU, or Vista.

If you check the next post, Jazzy has dual cores.

Post by **Badeend** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 5:21 pm

Hengari wrote:
Tijny wrote:
Hengari wrote:Have you tried running the game on just 1 CPU like explained in viewtopic.php?p=10226#10226 or tried the tips concerning running TS in Vista: viewtopic.php?t=1134
If you read a little further, you can see that he doesn't have a dual core CPU, or Vista.
If you check the next post, Jazzy has dual cores.

Then you should have quoted Jazzy instead of me

Hengari · Post by **Hengari** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 5:37 pm

Badeend wrote:
Hengari wrote:
Tijny wrote:If you read a little further, you can see that he doesn't have a dual core CPU, or Vista.
If you check the next post, Jazzy has dual cores.
Then you should have quoted Jazzy instead of me

But you had better question.

xzeal · Post by **xzeal** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 5:50 pm

Insane warps?

Well I was playing on Maunos server, I assume it was him causing the lag and not me for a moment. Anyway His roommate or what ever was downloading porn and there were some ping jumps (nothing weird there).

However the warps I was getting were insane. In 1.0.x the car kept going in the last known direction and then jump back to where it really was.

in 2.0.x the cars jumped to the middle of the screen and then abck to where they really weird. I'm going to get seizures in a warpy server if it's like that :S.

EDIT: Well lag magically disappeared and never happened again... had some normal warps (the way I know them) though.

Ande · Post by **Ande** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:17 pm

I will make one more build this week and it will yet again invalidate old records, and backward compatibility to rc2 and rc1 will be lost. Hopefully, this is the last time that has to be done. At least now I really hope to have fixed it. I will still test it for a couple of days and maybe try to do something about the other problems, too.

I hated to hear about people having problems with the new SDL without DirectX. I really wish they would fix SDL since there is not much I can do about it but to try to guess whether to use windib or DirectX by random. In the old SDL, which was included in TS 1.0.8, DirectX is always used. This is fast without alpha blending on, but if there are 20 cars, with alpha blending, shadows and smoke on, it gets ridiculously slow. The new SDL which is included in TS 2.0.0 uses windib by default. In windib, alpha blending is not slow but overall, it is slightly slower. In all machines in which I have tested it, it has been faster than DirectX with lots of cars and smoke etc. But now it seems that on some machines, it is always super slow. If you set DirectX on in 2.0.0, it should be like the old SDL. So the main problem is, whether to use DirectX or not by default. For most, windib is the better option but for some, it seems to be disastrous. I really hope I had decided to use some other graphics library in the beginning of the project...

Could all of you who have problems with windib (TS 2.0.0, DirectX turned OFF) tell the specs of your computer, maybe we can find something. Could you also paste Main window properties from output.txt. For example, mine were in windowed mode:
1280 x 800 bpp: 32 Bpp: 4 pitch: 5120 size: 4000 kB (4096000)
RGBA masks: ff0000,ff00,ff,0 shifts: 16,8,0,0 losses: 0,0,0,8
colorkey: 0 alpha: 255
SWSURFACE: 0 HWSURFACE: 0 ASYNCBLIT: 0 ANYFORMAT: 0
HWPALETTE: 1 DOUBLEBUF: 0 FULLSCREEN: 0 OPENGL: 0
OPENGLBLIT: 0 RESIZABLE: 0 HWACCEL: 0 SRCCOLORKEY: 0
RLEACCEL: 0 SRCALPHA: 0 PREALLOC: 0

And xzeal, there shouldn't be anything that causes those mega-warps, if they keep happening, let me know. It may have been just a random problem with a particularly laggy server which would have happened with 1.0.8, too, but let me know if it seems to happen more often.

Flexman · Post by **Flexman** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:26 pm

Hmm.. I wished the tiles were less sticky. It would be a really nice improvement for 2.0 to make the behaviour a little bit better so that you somehow bump away from the objects but cannot get stuck to the pixels.

That was something I really didn't like in 1.x. In 0.x it was the same but at least objects didn't have such a sticky form.

Jarno · Post by **Jarno** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:44 pm

Flexman wrote:Hmm.. I wished the tiles were less sticky. It would be a really nice improvement for 2.0 to make the behaviour a little bit better so that you somehow bump away from the objects but cannot get stuck to the pixels.

That was something I really didn't like in 1.x. In 0.x it was the same but at least objects didn't have such a sticky form.

Try my bouncy tiles

Jarno · Post by **Jarno** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:07 pm

Computer Specs:
Amd Athlon 3400+
1gb ddr
X1950pro 512Mt
Windows xp sp2 directx 9.0c
Ts 2.0.0 rc2
SDL 1.2.13.0

Main window properties:
1280 x 1024 bpp: 32 Bpp: 4 pitch: 5120 size: 5120 kB (5242880)
RGBA masks: ff0000,ff00,ff,0 shifts: 16,8,0,0 losses: 0,0,0,8
colorkey: 0 alpha: 255
SWSURFACE: 0 HWSURFACE: 0 ASYNCBLIT: 0 ANYFORMAT: 0
HWPALETTE: 1 DOUBLEBUF: 0 FULLSCREEN: 1 OPENGL: 0
OPENGLBLIT: 0 RESIZABLE: 0 HWACCEL: 0 SRCCOLORKEY: 0
RLEACCEL: 0 SRCALPHA: 0 PREALLOC: 0

Game values with different settings(20players mode):
Full screen 1280x1024, directx off, alpha-blending on, eye candy full = 40FPS @ 100%
Full screen 1280x1024, directx off, alpha-blending off, eye candy full = 40FPS @ 100%
Windowed 1280x1024, directx off, alpha-blending on, eye candy full = 50FPS @ 95%
Windowed 1280x1024, directx off, alpha-blending off, eye candy full = 50FPS @ 90% -> Playable

Full screen 1280x1024, directx on, alpha-blending on, eye candy full = 50FPS @ 70-100%
Full screen 1280x1024, directx on, alpha-blending off, eye candy full = 50-52FPS @ 10-20%
Windowed 1280x1024, directx on, alpha-blending on, eye candy full = 50FPS @ 95%
Windowed 1280x1024, directx on, alpha-blending off, eye candy full = 50FPS @ 95% -> eh? what?

how can this be

So problem isnt FPS but cpu-usage. Last result is very weird

Post by **Tijny** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:12 pm

Flexman wrote:Hmm.. I wished the tiles were less sticky. It would be a really nice improvement for 2.0 to make the behaviour a little bit better so that you somehow bump away from the objects but cannot get stuck to the pixels.

That was something I really didn't like in 1.x. In 0.x it was the same but at least objects didn't have such a sticky form.

I kind of agree with you, but I guess modifying the default terrains at this point would cause most existing tracks to malfunction. I suppose you could create a total modification with modified terrains, though.

And about the SDL thing, I don't have any framelag issues using windib even with 20 players, but the car movements just aren't smooth (it's like the cars are a bit blurry). This also occurs with SDL 1.2.13 and DirectX turned on, that's why I chose to downgrade to 1.2.9.

My specs are:
Core 2 Duo E6600
Radeon HD4870
2GB DDR2
Windows XP SP2

Code: Select all

Main window properties: (using SDL 1.2.13.0)
  1280 x 1024  bpp: 32 Bpp: 4 pitch: 5120 size: 5120 kB (5242880)
  RGBA masks: ff0000,ff00,ff,0 shifts: 16,8,0,0 losses: 0,0,0,8
  colorkey: 0  alpha: 255
  SWSURFACE:  0  HWSURFACE: 0 ASYNCBLIT:  0 ANYFORMAT:   0 
  HWPALETTE:  1  DOUBLEBUF: 0 FULLSCREEN: 1 OPENGL:      0 
  OPENGLBLIT: 0  RESIZABLE: 0 HWACCEL:    0 SRCCOLORKEY: 0 
  RLEACCEL:   0  SRCALPHA:  0 PREALLOC:   0