Hello,what can you tell me about this?
http://www.orange-team.s5.com/contact.html
Thank you very much.
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JimMiE22o2
- Community User Level: 2
- Posts: 182
- Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:45 pm
- Contact:
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Z
With all respect, I don't find this ranking too useful. There are two reasons: - it concentrates only on lap records, which is just one minor aspect of racing and - the points-system has been determined subjectively, on so called "MUTU-feeling", if you like.
Going with this kind of ranking system is easy and understandable because the lap records are only stored data of all racing activities. This makes it hard to effectively measure racing itself - However, this has been done in mid-2004 and it will be implemented again this year, but there are couple of obstacles.
The first one is that if we're going to measure racing skills (speed, consistency and pressure handling - btw, there are the actual variables!), we need to do that on and only on GHOST server. Otherwise, too many uncontrollable issues may have effect on the results, as was argued last year.
I would like to ask Ande, Playtrix guys or anyone who has authority on these issues, could you please add two, long-term GHOST servers to the server-list? One for the demo-players (3 tracks) and one for the registered players (20 tracks), both of 12 players maximum. These servers would be in normal use, but occasionally I would organize special challenge-tournaments to selected group of players, and the race results would be stored, analysed and publicly available on special online result service system. The first this kind of challenge-tournament did get huge popularity in October 2004 and I honestly think that this will bring additional value to the players, which in turn are Jollygood's customers or potential customers, so that the firm itself should even have a financial ground to support this activity. So, Ande, Jani, what do you say?
And once again, yes, it needs to be a ghost server.
Going with this kind of ranking system is easy and understandable because the lap records are only stored data of all racing activities. This makes it hard to effectively measure racing itself - However, this has been done in mid-2004 and it will be implemented again this year, but there are couple of obstacles.
The first one is that if we're going to measure racing skills (speed, consistency and pressure handling - btw, there are the actual variables!), we need to do that on and only on GHOST server. Otherwise, too many uncontrollable issues may have effect on the results, as was argued last year.
I would like to ask Ande, Playtrix guys or anyone who has authority on these issues, could you please add two, long-term GHOST servers to the server-list? One for the demo-players (3 tracks) and one for the registered players (20 tracks), both of 12 players maximum. These servers would be in normal use, but occasionally I would organize special challenge-tournaments to selected group of players, and the race results would be stored, analysed and publicly available on special online result service system. The first this kind of challenge-tournament did get huge popularity in October 2004 and I honestly think that this will bring additional value to the players, which in turn are Jollygood's customers or potential customers, so that the firm itself should even have a financial ground to support this activity. So, Ande, Jani, what do you say?
And once again, yes, it needs to be a ghost server.
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diesel 999
- Community User Level: 1
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2005 1:13 pm
Thanks for reply,Z ! I know ,my English language is very bad,but if you have read my link you must saw the notices below.Here is one of them:
"Notice #1:We still have no official Tournaments in TS. But if we’ll do, we can add these points to Total Ranking List. I think, winning points from Official Tournaments would be more important then position in Record List."
However,thanks to all who has visited this link.
"Notice #1:We still have no official Tournaments in TS. But if we’ll do, we can add these points to Total Ranking List. I think, winning points from Official Tournaments would be more important then position in Record List."
However,thanks to all who has visited this link.
Go, [orange], go! 
No need to pamper the non-buyers.
Why the server for demo players? If the tournaments were only for registered players, it would give the would-be-buyers further incentive and offer some of that 'additional value' to buy the great game.Z wrote:I would like to ask Ande, Playtrix guys or anyone who has authority on these issues, could you please add two, long-term GHOST servers to the server-list? One for the demo-players (3 tracks) and one for the registered players (20 tracks), both of 12 players maximum.
No need to pamper the non-buyers.
Indeedz0r. And once again, plenty of good ideas you have, Z.Z wrote:And once again, yes, it needs to be a ghost server.
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Z
diesel, you're right, this is the right way to go. Online competition should always overcome offline track-records what comes to measuring players' skills. I've noticed that [orange] is full of activity currently, which I hope will continue for a long time. Also I wish, that we could do some co-work with these tournaments in the future.diesel 999 wrote:Thanks for reply,Z ! I know ,my English language is very bad,but if you have read my link you must saw the notices below.Here is one of them:
"Notice #1:We still have no official Tournaments in TS. But if we’ll do, we can add these points to Total Ranking List. I think, winning points from Official Tournaments would be more important then position in Record List."
However,thanks to all who has visited this link.
The thing is that records are already SO heavily emphasized what comes to the ranking issues, that IMO they shouldn't be brought to any ranking system anymore (as this strong element).
To organize official tournaments (of significant number!) and analyze the data carefully is the way to determine who's the fastest, most consistant driver with the highest pressure-handling ability. Playtrix ghost is an essential place for this (which unfortunately doesn't exist currently!). And Kobra, I agree with you there, from the viewpoint of JGG, it would be best to offer this kind of "service" only for registered players. It's even possible to structure a very high-quality out-side service-package out of these issues (which IMO should be built game-inside!) to incentive for registeration. This would require JGG's involvement (in marketing communication, mostly). But anyhow, I'm interested to organize this activity in a smaller scale (like I did almost a year ago). The feedback I got was very positive, and I sincerely believe that the idea of TSRR online tool and its way to sort results was the best of all TS tournaments organized so far.
In addition to ghost-element, the official tournament server should have random starting order and - now that it is possible - random car selection, with maximum of 12 players. Anyone of the participants shouldn't be hosting this server. This is the right environment for ranking tournaments, which minimize random variables involved (like unfair collisions, high traffic, poor knowledge in car selection and also lags (as much as possible)).
I started now 3 times in a row a long text about that official tournament stuff...
Now the 4th one...omg
Now in short words...:
Ande/All:
So far i made few small and bigger TS tools. I spent lot of time for statistic tools etc.
But that what i am still going to develop might be some day not anymore necessary for TS purposes. So, i have to know if - then when certain feature might exist...
[Edit: In longer words ^^:]
Examples:
1)
People want to make an automatic server.
x tracks, but the laps for each track is different.
MiniLeap 8 laps, Forestry 4 laps, Sandlid 6 laps for example.
This is not possible yet in TS, but with a tool, i can manage this.
2a)
AutoServer:
Next to the recordserverlist, generated by /generatestats in cupend in macros.ini, there should be an option in the settings...
2b)
In addition it might be nice, if options like GenerateCupStats On/Off would be implementable with the command /generatecupstats, for example.
So far, racestats and cupstats were written in the log.txt and my logfileinterpreter was able to make different html stats of that. Surely it might be less work for you to integrate that in the TS code than the work i had to do.
2c)
Integrated Statistics/Rankings (a database) for servers, which are writing race results etc. in a database of players (playerhashvalues) from which even more statistics can be generated AND command like /statsme can be created. Different statistic options would then allow saving:
chatlog (with timestamp), how much was chatted (average, maximal and when) by players (like in IRC-Stats) and racestats can be listed (number of wins, fastest laps, average number of opponents, laps driven at track xy with car xy, best racetime at track xy and car xy...tons of possible statistics!, i cannot count them all here...). All in all a...
2d) possibility of ranking systems (which might work with different rankingsystem settings) like for example HL Stats would allow giving Servers AllTime Rankings, or monthly rankings or rankings of last 20 days - or conercning 2c): independent statistics instead of rankings.
So far even the statistic (-tools) and different ranking systems (-tools) were created in different forms for Turbo Sliders in unofficial forms.
2e) /generateserverstats and or /generaterankings or whatever...or all (update of recordlists, add of last cupresults to a folder of all cups or last xy cups, update of alltime/monthly/last xy days - statistics (and rankings)) would be generated in 1 command, since the command can detect the settings, if a recordlist is wished or only cupresults and no big parts of the huge amount of statistics of a serverstatisticsdatabase...
So, if there will be something involved...what it will be and when it will be implemented and released?
All that official statistic and tournanent stuff, which is even possible to create yet with own tools would be great to know, if they will be implemented soon or not and what plans are there etc.
Oh, 1 i forgot:
3) If there are no /generate... commands in addition, then and anyway a command /executefile <filename> might be nice as macrocommand, since tools or GenerateStats.exe's can be executed then every cupend for example. So far, i had to run statistic tools while the server was running to catch the log.txt updates.
Problems: statistics are realtime uptodate and with some scripts, serveradmins can execute commands to generate stats from chat...but during the cup there might be sometimes calculations of small updates, but actually that is no real problem. But the window next to the running server might be nerving, if there is an application window.
For some serveradministators it might be easier/better to have just executable statisticupdaters/generators. After each cup there would be a maybe 5 second lag
while these tools are executed automatically (when there is execution support in the macros.ini).
I have to say, the amout of possible statistics, servers and tournament/league... systems are quite big and it is nice to develop them each time new for me, actually, but all i do is unoffical work and in soon days i can imagine, there will exist official servers/tournaments with integrated statistics and rankings, which are updated in realtime (playerstats after race...) or every cupend (cupstats and racestats...) and uploaded automatically at a webspace.
Hmm, maybe you like to hear a bit of those tournament system anyway, which i really prefer:
Time: Weekly and/or Monthly
GhostRace: Yes (and No -> what means there are 2 times so many tournaments)
Laps: for example 8 (but there can of course exist endurance races like 20-50 laps or 1 lap competitions, though these are more fun and shouldnt be official)
Races: 23 default tracks, in random order (at endurance cups of course less tracks, maybe 8-10 with 20-25 laps maximal when the tournament would be in 1 cup -> but yes, there can exist tournaments over several days...)
Order:
Random start order: is fair in nonghostrace and ghostrace, actually
Cup Positions: NonGhostRace) make the cup easy to those who got many points in early races of the cup. In the most time, the best players will win then.
GhostRace) Example: <=4 laps, Arena, AntiSlider: then cup position order would cause that 1st might win the race really easier...what might be no good solution, perhaps, but still okay.
Reverse Cup Positions: NonGhostRace) adds tension to the cup, but then drivers win, which are actually not gaining the win of the race in many cases.
GhostRace) well, doesn't matter much actually...
Last Race Positions: that might be interesting. The last race would define a kind of qualification race. On that way, even drivers, who joined the cup few races later, they would have a chance to start in front, when they are good drivers. This might be a very good solution for NonGhostRace-Servers, when the wish is there, that there won't exist battles between very fast drivers and slow drivers in 1st laps. Instead it is easier the case, that drivers with circa the same skill are competing since the start, in average.
Reverse Last Race Positions: Not really good for tournaments, i think...
Systems: tournaments can be 1 cup or the can be a cup with like 8 players, the best 4 are qualified to the next weekend or day etc. - that would describe for example a monthly "cup" like in soccer. 4 Weeks a month -> 4 cups -> maximal 8 or 12 or 16 or 20 players a cup, depending on how many take part in the evolution ^^ of TS and the half is getting in the next round.
Or the tournament is only 1 or less races, each week, with many laps and there can be created kinds of seasons.
Or 1 season is done in 1 cup at 1 day in a week or 2 weeks or a month and a leaguesystem would create lots of possibilities.
Examples:
AntiSlider Ghost League
EasySlider NonGhost League
Random Fixed Default Car Ghost League
Default Car Ghost League
To list all official possibilities:
AntiSlider, EasySlider, Slider, Speeder, Spinner, Default Cars (5 cars are free choosable), Random Fixed Default Cars -> and all Ghost and NonGhost.
That means: (5+1+1) *2 => 14 different leagues
7 Ghost Leagues parallel to the 7 NonGhost Leagues (or instead: 14 weekly/monthly those cups (tournaments) and or instead: 14 monthly cups with 4 rounds)
An AntiSlider Ghost League System would look like this for example:
Time: Weekly:
1 1st division.
2 2nd divisions.
4 3rd divisions.
8 4th divisions.
8 player each division.
random startorder, 8 laps, 23 races.
1st 2 are getting 1 division higher. Last 4 are getting 1 division lower:
Example CupResult of a "2nd" Division:
1st: Driver qualified to 1st division in next week.
2nd: Driver qualified to 1st division in next week.
3rd: Driver qualified to 2nd division in next week.
4th: Driver qualified to 2nd division in next week.
5th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
6th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
7th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
8th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
Advantage: When there are inactive drivers or drivers who miss a cupday by accident, they fall quick down in lower divisions. And the divisions don't stay equal for long time.
Another Example:
A Speeder NonGhost League System would look like this for example:
Time: Monthly:
1 1st division.
4 2nd divisions.
16 3rd divisions.
[64 4th divisions.]
16 player each division.
random startorder, 8 laps, 23 races.
1st 2 are getting 1 division higher. Last 8 are getting 1 division lower. Places 3-8 are keeping in the division.
Why so many players?
Since the divisions are only 1 time monthly, new very good players would need from lowest division into 2nd or 1st division 2 or 3 months
Disadvantage: 16 players cause much lag maybe. A good server with less lag would allow a 16 player /division system, which might be nice in ghostrace leagues and nonghostleagues with many laps for example.
An official tournament server would be great for these cases. But there must exists timezones, when the divisions are starting. The more divisions, the more times or servers are needed though...
So, it might be nice, when, like Z asked also kind equal, a tournament server would start with maybe a random fixed default car ghostrace league.
The qualification to the 1st period of the leagues would then depend on for example the totallaptimesum or a qualification week/month on a special server, where the sum of the laptimes AND/OR the racetotaltimes are deciding. I think, there exist many good qualification systems. So...to get sure, active players, who want to take part in those tournaments, have just to drive at the tournamentservers when they are still in qualification status. So the divisions will be filled with relative active players quick.
A question might be, if there might exist also demo track leagues. I think, actually they should not exist though it might be nice for the demo players...
But when there would exist something, then the amount of laps would be surely 20-25 or more
Or actually, if possible: trackdependend. Example: MiniLeap: 50 laps (~500 seconds AntiSlider?) , Sandslid: 25-30 laps (~450-540 seconds AntiSlider?) , Forestry 20 laps (~500 seconds AntiSlider?).
With a raceinit time of at least 100 seconds maybe, so people can have small drink puase or whatever (most don't need it actually, but sometimes it should be).
Another question to the division might be, next to the number of players / division and the servers...: the number of 2nd divisions:
If there exists only 1 2nd division (1 3rd, 1 4th) then there should be many players in a league (16 or 20) and a division should be at least weekly. Since there might be for example 100 active drivers and in future maybe more, there will exist many divisions. So far, this solution is still possible, actually, since there are less drivers ;/
The low time period must exist, since new good drivers should have a good chance to get quick in higher divisions.
With 16 Players, the first 4, 5 or 6 might get in higher division and the less 4, 5 or 6 might get in lower division.
With 2 2nd divisions, it might be easier to get faster in higher divisions later. And inactive players will fall down faster.
Even 3 or 4 2nd divisions might exist later, when the idea is soluted and running good with a huge community. If the time period would be monthly (each 1st sunday in the month maybe) then, with many new players, the time period can be each 1st and 3rd sunday (each 2nd or sometimes 3rd week...) or just each sunday (weekly) - on this way getting in higher leagues will be faster, messed in realtime.
For autoservers, a weekly timebased configuration would be maybe easier to solute than monthly tournaments, by the way.
So, wether the league(s) would start with only 1 or 2 2nd divisions, it might be no problem to split divisions into more divisions each step:
When starting with 1 2nd division for example and a later 2 x 2nd division system, just the 3rd division will be the 2nd "2nd Division". Though that might be kind unfair in some cases.
But think about it, serveradmins, tournament hosters, league interested TS fans out there!
Now the 4th one...omg
Now in short words...:
Ande/All:
So far i made few small and bigger TS tools. I spent lot of time for statistic tools etc.
But that what i am still going to develop might be some day not anymore necessary for TS purposes. So, i have to know if - then when certain feature might exist...
[Edit: In longer words ^^:]
Examples:
1)
People want to make an automatic server.
x tracks, but the laps for each track is different.
MiniLeap 8 laps, Forestry 4 laps, Sandlid 6 laps for example.
This is not possible yet in TS, but with a tool, i can manage this.
2a)
AutoServer:
Next to the recordserverlist, generated by /generatestats in cupend in macros.ini, there should be an option in the settings...
2b)
In addition it might be nice, if options like GenerateCupStats On/Off would be implementable with the command /generatecupstats, for example.
So far, racestats and cupstats were written in the log.txt and my logfileinterpreter was able to make different html stats of that. Surely it might be less work for you to integrate that in the TS code than the work i had to do.
2c)
Integrated Statistics/Rankings (a database) for servers, which are writing race results etc. in a database of players (playerhashvalues) from which even more statistics can be generated AND command like /statsme can be created. Different statistic options would then allow saving:
chatlog (with timestamp), how much was chatted (average, maximal and when) by players (like in IRC-Stats) and racestats can be listed (number of wins, fastest laps, average number of opponents, laps driven at track xy with car xy, best racetime at track xy and car xy...tons of possible statistics!
, i cannot count them all here...). All in all a...2d) possibility of ranking systems (which might work with different rankingsystem settings) like for example HL Stats would allow giving Servers AllTime Rankings, or monthly rankings or rankings of last 20 days - or conercning 2c): independent statistics instead of rankings.
So far even the statistic (-tools) and different ranking systems (-tools) were created in different forms for Turbo Sliders in unofficial forms.
2e) /generateserverstats and or /generaterankings or whatever...or all (update of recordlists, add of last cupresults to a folder of all cups or last xy cups, update of alltime/monthly/last xy days - statistics (and rankings)) would be generated in 1 command, since the command can detect the settings, if a recordlist is wished or only cupresults and no big parts of the huge amount of statistics of a serverstatisticsdatabase...
So, if there will be something involved...what it will be and when it will be implemented and released?
All that official statistic and tournanent stuff, which is even possible to create yet with own tools would be great to know, if they will be implemented soon or not and what plans are there etc.
Oh, 1 i forgot:
3) If there are no /generate... commands in addition, then and anyway a command /executefile <filename> might be nice as macrocommand, since tools or GenerateStats.exe's can be executed then every cupend for example. So far, i had to run statistic tools while the server was running to catch the log.txt updates.
Problems: statistics are realtime uptodate and with some scripts, serveradmins can execute commands to generate stats from chat...but during the cup there might be sometimes calculations of small updates, but actually that is no real problem. But the window next to the running server might be nerving, if there is an application window.
For some serveradministators it might be easier/better to have just executable statisticupdaters/generators. After each cup there would be a maybe 5 second lag
while these tools are executed automatically (when there is execution support in the macros.ini).I have to say, the amout of possible statistics, servers and tournament/league... systems are quite big and it is nice to develop them each time new for me, actually
, but all i do is unoffical work and in soon days i can imagine, there will exist official servers/tournaments with integrated statistics and rankings, which are updated in realtime (playerstats after race...) or every cupend (cupstats and racestats...) and uploaded automatically at a webspace.Hmm, maybe you like to hear a bit of those tournament system anyway, which i really prefer
:Time: Weekly and/or Monthly
GhostRace: Yes (and No -> what means there are 2 times so many tournaments)
Laps: for example 8 (but there can of course exist endurance races like 20-50 laps or 1 lap competitions, though these are more fun and shouldnt be official)
Races: 23 default tracks, in random order
(at endurance cups of course less tracks, maybe 8-10 with 20-25 laps maximal when the tournament would be in 1 cup -> but yes, there can exist tournaments over several days...)Order:
Random start order: is fair in nonghostrace and ghostrace, actually
Cup Positions: NonGhostRace) make the cup easy to those who got many points in early races of the cup. In the most time, the best players will win then.
GhostRace) Example: <=4 laps, Arena, AntiSlider: then cup position order would cause that 1st might win the race really easier...what might be no good solution, perhaps, but still okay.
Reverse Cup Positions: NonGhostRace) adds tension to the cup, but then drivers win, which are actually not gaining the win of the race in many cases.
GhostRace) well, doesn't matter much actually...
Last Race Positions: that might be interesting. The last race would define a kind of qualification race. On that way, even drivers, who joined the cup few races later, they would have a chance to start in front, when they are good drivers. This might be a very good solution for NonGhostRace-Servers, when the wish is there, that there won't exist battles between very fast drivers and slow drivers in 1st laps. Instead it is easier the case, that drivers with circa the same skill are competing since the start, in average.
Reverse Last Race Positions: Not really good for tournaments, i think...
Systems: tournaments can be 1 cup or the can be a cup with like 8 players, the best 4 are qualified to the next weekend or day etc. - that would describe for example a monthly "cup" like in soccer
. 4 Weeks a month -> 4 cups -> maximal 8 or 12 or 16 or 20 players a cup, depending on how many take part in the evolution ^^ of TS and the half is getting in the next round.Or the tournament is only 1 or less races, each week, with many laps and there can be created kinds of seasons.
Or 1 season is done in 1 cup at 1 day in a week or 2 weeks or a month and a leaguesystem would create lots of possibilities.
Examples:
AntiSlider Ghost League
EasySlider NonGhost League
Random Fixed Default Car Ghost League
Default Car Ghost League
To list all official possibilities:
AntiSlider, EasySlider, Slider, Speeder, Spinner, Default Cars (5 cars are free choosable), Random Fixed Default Cars -> and all Ghost and NonGhost.
That means: (5+1+1) *2 => 14 different leagues
7 Ghost Leagues parallel to the 7 NonGhost Leagues (or instead: 14 weekly/monthly those cups (tournaments) and or instead: 14 monthly cups with 4 rounds)
An AntiSlider Ghost League System would look like this for example:
Time: Weekly:
1 1st division.
2 2nd divisions.
4 3rd divisions.
8 4th divisions.
8 player each division.
random startorder, 8 laps, 23 races.
1st 2 are getting 1 division higher. Last 4 are getting 1 division lower:
Example CupResult of a "2nd" Division:
1st: Driver qualified to 1st division in next week.
2nd: Driver qualified to 1st division in next week.
3rd: Driver qualified to 2nd division in next week.
4th: Driver qualified to 2nd division in next week.
5th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
6th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
7th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
8th: Driver qualified to 3rd division in next week.
Advantage: When there are inactive drivers or drivers who miss a cupday by accident, they fall quick down in lower divisions. And the divisions don't stay equal for long time.
Another Example:
A Speeder NonGhost League System would look like this for example:
Time: Monthly:
1 1st division.
4 2nd divisions.
16 3rd divisions.
[64 4th divisions.]
16 player each division.
random startorder, 8 laps, 23 races.
1st 2 are getting 1 division higher. Last 8 are getting 1 division lower. Places 3-8 are keeping in the division.
Why so many players?
Since the divisions are only 1 time monthly, new very good players would need from lowest division into 2nd or 1st division 2 or 3 months
Disadvantage: 16 players cause much lag maybe. A good server with less lag would allow a 16 player /division system, which might be nice in ghostrace leagues and nonghostleagues with many laps for example.
An official tournament server would be great for these cases. But there must exists timezones, when the divisions are starting. The more divisions, the more times or servers are needed though...
So, it might be nice, when, like Z asked also kind equal, a tournament server would start with maybe a random fixed default car ghostrace league.
The qualification to the 1st period of the leagues would then depend on for example the totallaptimesum or a qualification week/month on a special server, where the sum of the laptimes AND/OR the racetotaltimes are deciding. I think, there exist many good qualification systems. So...to get sure, active players, who want to take part in those tournaments, have just to drive at the tournamentservers when they are still in qualification status. So the divisions will be filled with relative active players quick.
A question might be, if there might exist also demo track leagues. I think, actually they should not exist though it might be nice for the demo players...
But when there would exist something, then the amount of laps would be surely 20-25 or more
Or actually, if possible: trackdependend. Example: MiniLeap: 50 laps (~500 seconds AntiSlider?) , Sandslid: 25-30 laps (~450-540 seconds AntiSlider?) , Forestry 20 laps (~500 seconds AntiSlider?).
With a raceinit time of at least 100 seconds maybe, so people can have small drink puase or whatever (most don't need it actually, but sometimes it should be
).Another question to the division might be, next to the number of players / division and the servers...: the number of 2nd divisions:
If there exists only 1 2nd division (1 3rd, 1 4th) then there should be many players in a league (16 or 20) and a division should be at least weekly. Since there might be for example 100 active drivers and in future maybe more, there will exist many divisions. So far, this solution is still possible, actually, since there are less drivers ;/
The low time period must exist, since new good drivers should have a good chance to get quick in higher divisions.
With 16 Players, the first 4, 5 or 6 might get in higher division and the less 4, 5 or 6 might get in lower division.
With 2 2nd divisions, it might be easier to get faster in higher divisions later. And inactive players will fall down faster.
Even 3 or 4 2nd divisions might exist later, when the idea is soluted and running good with a huge community. If the time period would be monthly (each 1st sunday in the month maybe) then, with many new players, the time period can be each 1st and 3rd sunday (each 2nd or sometimes 3rd week...) or just each sunday (weekly) - on this way getting in higher leagues will be faster, messed in realtime.
For autoservers, a weekly timebased configuration would be maybe easier to solute than monthly tournaments, by the way.
So, wether the league(s) would start with only 1 or 2 2nd divisions, it might be no problem to split divisions into more divisions each step:
When starting with 1 2nd division for example and a later 2 x 2nd division system, just the 3rd division will be the 2nd "2nd Division". Though that might be kind unfair in some cases.
But think about it, serveradmins, tournament hosters, league interested TS fans out there!
Last edited by Mike Nike on Wed Apr 20, 2005 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
JimMiE22o2
- Community User Level: 2
- Posts: 182
- Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:45 pm
- Contact:
@Jimmie
See Tijnys post...and: i would wish i would have that big freetime than you or few others here. The day i wrote the post i had no need to go to school though
But the thoughts about TS related tournament systems are coming while driving or while falling asleep in the bed, so i haven't invested extra time for me post. I wrote it "quick" down. That took maybe the same time like 1 Rally Cup with 10 races and 6 laps
@Radkon
You would still see me in that case, i guess, but surely not so often anymore
@Tijny
Thanks Tijny. True words.
@All who read my long post (and it was meant to tournament hosters, Ande and serveradmins...)
Sorry for that long post. I really wrote it quick and haven't seen (like so often) how much i wrote there ^^.
See Tijnys post...and: i would wish i would have that big freetime than you or few others here. The day i wrote the post i had no need to go to school though
But the thoughts about TS related tournament systems are coming while driving or while falling asleep in the bed, so i haven't invested extra time for me post. I wrote it "quick" down. That took maybe the same time like 1 Rally Cup with 10 races and 6 laps
@Radkon
You would still see me in that case, i guess, but surely not so often anymore
@Tijny
Thanks Tijny. True words.
@All who read my long post (and it was meant to tournament hosters, Ande and serveradmins...)
Sorry for that long post. I really wrote it quick and haven't seen (like so often) how much i wrote there ^^.
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JimMiE22o2
- Community User Level: 2
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Well, all I can say, that the amount of interest and support from the developers was TREMENDOUS! Wow, I mean, even "no" would've done it better.Z wrote: I would like to ask Ande - - or anyone who has authority on these issues, could you please add two, long-term GHOST servers to the server-list? - -The first this kind of challenge-tournament did get huge popularity in October 2004 and I honestly think that this will bring additional value to the players, which in turn are Jollygood's customers or potential customers, so that the firm itself should even have a financial ground to support this activity. So, Ande, Jani, what do you say?
If the "technical side" of TS development is the only important thing, then let it be so, but I can hardly see how AI-algorithms, graphics (even some 3D-talk has been around! (...)) and stuff may overcome the meaning of game-inside-community. There's only a few people who actually can see that the value the player gets from the game is heavily based on social activity. And I now understand that no one is really interested in improving these kind of issues...of course they (terms like community, involvement, value, satisfaction, word of mouth) are abstract and so hard to deal with, whereas "algorithms" are pure programmer-engineer-stuff. Logical, sure.
And then you wonder the low percent of registeration...
There has been couple of good, but short-lived, versions of "integrated community". Now there isn't such a thing, at all! Even this message board gives an "official" view of itself; it's more like a communication channel of official issues, questions, comments, but not so much of fan-issues. Occasionally people post here about their teams, new members and stuff, but that discussion doesn't belong here. This is more like for this kind of issues: "version 1.0.4.2 has been released. it has enchanced polygon graphics". Those "social issues" are then spread on about dozen of fan sites, which all have the same talk, same members and same tournaments. There is no integration! The most benefit from this could be get if JGG would put some effort to make a real base for fans (IF this couldn't be implemented INSIDE the actual game). Now, the wheel is re-invented again and again. For example, those tournaments of all teams, they COMPETE against each other, resulting in lower level of average participation. Instead, this kind of effort should support itself.
As I've seen that the authority doesn't care about this, I have hard time to care about it by myself either. Hopefully, someone someday will connect the technical know-how of Ande and Mike Nike with the enthusiasm of Mike Nike with someone who translates those over-complex theories to practise with the ideas of bazwoll with the tournament-organizer-skills of xzeal with the new ideas of [orange]-team with the one, common, simple but versatile communication base for every TS player.
I'm out of this activity as long as there ain't any real interest from the top.
I'm sorry I have not been reading this thread activily, probably because of its topic (looked like something else than what it was).
Your point is good, though. Unfortunately, I don't have much authority over Playtrix servers or many other servers, either. It is a pity that there currently aren't ghost servers but hopefully, someone will make them in the future. I understand the need for more community related issues but quite frankly, I can't add my current workload for the TS project. Community doesn't mean that one guy does all by himself. Jollygood has promised to support people who want to contribute, for example by giving web space. The game already generates logs that could be used to generate any kinds of logs if there are people willing to do the scripts.
Your point is good, though. Unfortunately, I don't have much authority over Playtrix servers or many other servers, either. It is a pity that there currently aren't ghost servers but hopefully, someone will make them in the future. I understand the need for more community related issues but quite frankly, I can't add my current workload for the TS project. Community doesn't mean that one guy does all by himself
. Jollygood has promised to support people who want to contribute, for example by giving web space. The game already generates logs that could be used to generate any kinds of logs if there are people willing to do the scripts.-
Z
I just hope, that someday the game itself would use those logs it generates. Or it would support actual tournaments. Cups are driven again and again but no information remains from any of them. You have a driver name, but nothing behind it. You can't see what you did yesterday or what your friends did yesterday. (The only history-related item in 0.86b was the data on .exe-running times!) Fake-drivers drive backwards with other drivers' names. The only communication channel of the game is the chat.
Wouldn't the issues related to these be among the some very essential incentives for further registerations? Wouldn't they even be more effective than "20 tracks"? Wouldn't they in this way have a financial effect which could perhaps justify some required timely effort?
Well, I know that it's your game, with your vision and schedule, and I honestly apologize if I bring my ideas up too agressively. But anyway, they are, and always will be, on my "wishlist"
Wouldn't the issues related to these be among the some very essential incentives for further registerations? Wouldn't they even be more effective than "20 tracks"? Wouldn't they in this way have a financial effect which could perhaps justify some required timely effort?
Well, I know that it's your game, with your vision and schedule, and I honestly apologize if I bring my ideas up too agressively. But anyway, they are, and always will be, on my "wishlist"
Here is an example of a racing game, who has got an official page with an integrated statistic system:
http://www.miniracingonline.com
I tested the game weeks ago, but i haven't liked it, since the car physics and some other physical parts were not convincing me. In addition i like to play games, where each drivers has got the same chances, so additional things like car setups etc. is too much for my taste. But that's the game of mr online - it's kind F1...
But have a look at the page. You might not understand all, but you can see more or less, what they have done there...
Ranking systems, player accounts, teams, nationality as additional profile property etc.
A lot of statistics and all is kind automatic!
Surely these statistics may influence drivers driving behaviour etc., but i would give my vote for them
Maybe there will exist a system, where servers have an option of "Send Statistics to Official Statistic Master Server" or something. On that way, 1 official master server, which would have a lot of traffic by the way :/, would get statistics from these servers who are "connected" to the stats system.
So, serveradmins can decide, when creating dedicated servers, or maybe even manual servers, if the statistics will be involved into the official statistics or not.
This would allow though uncontrollable serverregistrations...
So it might be better to have that kind of generating html statistics for each server as part of serversettings.
So, the best would be maybe, if at least the official servers would contain an integrated statisticsystem, maybe not only 1 statistic of 1 server - instead 1 great statistic of all official servers together.
So, with some system, maybe even unofficial servers can get a half official status, when being integrated into the group of servers, which are sending statistics to the official statistic master server.
Example: the often visited Playtrix Server - though i would give all my vote to it, that PTX Servers won't become a kind of official status
(even already because there are tracks, which have bad checklines...)
So, Z, Ande, Jani and the rest of the interested people ->
give your opinion if you want or maybe you have, like me, already thought much about different statistic systems and includable statistics etc.
Problems like traffic for the master server and the probably full or partly missing downward compatibility of this eventually TurboSliders 1.0.x (x>>4) would exist and need to be discussed.
Why i wrote ">>"? Because i think, in addition to the html stats of records and the recordserver and the data, the logfile is giving, an integrates statistic system would not exist very soon. I can imagine, Ande would think about that all with pleasure, but like me, he is a programer, who has to think realistic to the time component - 1 programer only can do surely much alone, but it just takes much time. I even wonder, how much time Ande already has got in his time schedule. He really spends much time for TS...next to the time, he is investing daily for the part of support (checking the forum, answering private messages and emails), he cannot have so much time to the development, next to his real life and study and or job etc.
Fortunately, the TS community is giving kind enough feedback of what is going wrong (bug reports etc.) or what is good and what is missing (feature requests...) - so Ande has not the problem to think about additional features of TS by himself - he can concentrate more on doing the final decisions of what TS may/should have as feature and what not or what priority the feature would have. And the design and special kinds of implementating the features is his free author right, but surely influenced at least a bit by all of us TS supporters/fans.
http://www.miniracingonline.com
I tested the game weeks ago, but i haven't liked it, since the car physics and some other physical parts were not convincing me. In addition i like to play games, where each drivers has got the same chances, so additional things like car setups etc. is too much for my taste. But that's the game of mr online - it's kind F1...
But have a look at the page. You might not understand all, but you can see more or less, what they have done there...
Ranking systems, player accounts, teams, nationality as additional profile property etc.
A lot of statistics and all is kind automatic!
Surely these statistics may influence drivers driving behaviour etc., but i would give my vote for them
Maybe there will exist a system, where servers have an option of "Send Statistics to Official Statistic Master Server" or something. On that way, 1 official master server, which would have a lot of traffic by the way :/, would get statistics from these servers who are "connected" to the stats system.
So, serveradmins can decide, when creating dedicated servers, or maybe even manual servers, if the statistics will be involved into the official statistics or not.
This would allow though uncontrollable serverregistrations...
So it might be better to have that kind of generating html statistics for each server as part of serversettings.
So, the best would be maybe, if at least the official servers would contain an integrated statisticsystem, maybe not only 1 statistic of 1 server - instead 1 great statistic of all official servers together.
So, with some system, maybe even unofficial servers can get a half official status, when being integrated into the group of servers, which are sending statistics to the official statistic master server.
Example: the often visited Playtrix Server - though i would give all my vote to it, that PTX Servers won't become a kind of official status
(even already because there are tracks, which have bad checklines...)
So, Z, Ande, Jani and the rest of the interested people ->
give your opinion if you want or maybe you have, like me, already thought much about different statistic systems and includable statistics etc.
Problems like traffic for the master server and the probably full or partly missing downward compatibility of this eventually TurboSliders 1.0.x (x>>4) would exist and need to be discussed.
Why i wrote ">>"? Because i think, in addition to the html stats of records and the recordserver and the data, the logfile is giving, an integrates statistic system would not exist very soon. I can imagine, Ande would think about that all with pleasure, but like me, he is a programer, who has to think realistic to the time component - 1 programer only can do surely much alone, but it just takes much time. I even wonder, how much time Ande already has got in his time schedule. He really spends much time for TS...next to the time, he is investing daily for the part of support (checking the forum, answering private messages and emails), he cannot have so much time to the development, next to his real life and study and or job etc.
Fortunately, the TS community is giving kind enough feedback of what is going wrong (bug reports etc.) or what is good and what is missing (feature requests...) - so Ande has not the problem to think about additional features of TS by himself - he can concentrate more on doing the final decisions of what TS may/should have as feature and what not or what priority the feature would have. And the design and special kinds of implementating the features is his free author right, but surely influenced at least a bit by all of us TS supporters/fans.
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diesel 999
- Community User Level: 1
- Posts: 46
- Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2005 1:13 pm
O M G !!!
Whata Rank Page there , at MikeNike link:
http://www.miniracingonline.com/rank.ph ... G&Inicio=0
Wow!
No more comment and I'm feeling sad now ...
Whata Rank Page there , at MikeNike link:
http://www.miniracingonline.com/rank.ph ... G&Inicio=0
Wow!
No more comment and I'm feeling sad now ...
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fasteddie399
- Community User Level: 2
- Posts: 162
- Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:53 am
hmph... nobody from USA on the list... boy, we americans suck at racing!Whata Rank Page there , at MikeNike link:
http://www.miniracingonline.com/rank.ph ... G&Inicio=0
